Rorate Caeli

For the Record:
Fellay: Pope sending "experts" to "difficult nations".

When he was in Lausanne, Switzerland, for the consecration of an altar, the Superior General of the Priestly Fraternity of Saint Pius X (FSSPX/SSPX), Bishop Bernard Fellay, delivered a sermon which we have already mentioned. Afterwards, Fellay gave a conference, in which the motu proprio had a prominent position.

After mentioning the several cardinalatial references to the document (including Bertone's assurance that it will be published), Fellay states (audio file):

[Aprox. 27 min] He [the Pope] has decided to prepare its publication by sending "experts" to the "hot" nations, to the nations in which there could be difficulties. How much time will it be necessary to prepare the ground? I do not know anything! It is mentioned now [that it may be published] towards the end of the year.
...
Now, does that mean that is necessary to wait for the end of the year, that it will [be published] sooner... I truly do not know. ... I bring you rumors, noises which come from Rome.

And we repeat: do not worry about the actual date of the document (or of its publication); that is a recipe for continued frustration.

28 comments:

poeta said...

Preparing the ground is an apt metaphor. This seed is too important to fall on rocks.

Bonagratia said...

It isn't the date of the publication that is important, it is the substance of the document, once it is put forward. If it offers nothing more than the Ecclesia Dei documents of 1984 and 1988 it will not be worth the paper it is written on. If it mandates provision of the Traditional Latin Mass for all who request it, then we will rejoice.

Tom S. said...

After all of the date-guessing, and all of the speculation, and the accompanying frustration, I must say that this is the most positive thing I have heard. This makes me no longer anxious about dates, etc. now I am content to know that, not only is it coming, but when it comes, it is going to have a BIG impact.

Assuming it's true (and it appears logical, under the circumstances), Poeta is right. This Pope has watched the previous one issuing decrees to intentionally deaf ears, and he has learned from that. He also realizes that he will only get one chance to do this, and he intends to make that one chance pay off.

Kopp said...

If it offers nothing more than the Ecclesia Dei documents of 1984 and 1988, why would the Pope bother sending out the shock troops to assure its acceptance?

Its going to be a bombshell.

Kopp said...

"Pope sending "experts" to "difficult nations".

Alternate Title:

Its the end of collegiality as we (post VII) know it.

This is a HUGE development!!! Its the Pope saying, before he lays down his ACES high full straight flush, the collegiality gig is up, chumps.

But in a very nice and gentlemanly fashion to boot.

Anonymous said...

Mr. Kopp, with all due respect: it will NOT be a bombshell -- unless it creates a separate Rite or some type of jurisdictional ordinariate. If the motu proprio is left to be executed by this group of bishops (like those in two entire bishops regional conferences that approved the morning after pill in Catholic hospitals), well, let's just say use your imagination.

Further, we've been hearing about this document being imminent from Bertone, Castrillon Hoyos and Ranjith (some of the Pope's highest ranking Curialistas) since around Christmas. Further delaying this document in an attempt to further "dialogue" with these episcopal wolves borders on mental cruelty.

Anonymous said...

This is an exercise in collegiality -- not an end to it. Any different read is simply not plausible given this Pope's track record. My Lord, Mr. Kopp, he just finished changing the rules of the tri-annual synod of bishops by making it for the first time a deliberative body on particular issues. If anything, Benedict is turning away from papal primacy and transforming the See of Peter into a constitutional monarchy.

Pascendi said...

The bishop's analysis seems to me to be an accurate assessment of a situation that pits the Pope and a small number of loyal churchmen against de facto schismatic bishops.

Anonymous said...

And just how do we know these "experts" are being sent, isnt this just rumor at this point? I would be interested to know if these "experts" are high ranking officials or simply a army of very conservative priests who know the TLM (go ahead and laugh, I know Im dreaming).

Further, it is interesting I didnt see any references to some example "hot nations"...unless that is a code word for USA and France.

At this point I will take any MP news I can get, even if its pure rumor.

Anonymous said...

At the risk of being trite, a watched pot never boils. Just sit back, have faith (that's what we Catholics are all about after all), and watch things unfold in due time.

Kopp said...

"This is an exercise in collegiality -- not an end to it."

Yeah, right. When was the last time a Pope sent out shock troops to tell recalcitrant bishops that they may no longer disobey a clear Vatican directive?

Some folks want to see doom and despair so much that when true good news is writ large, they have to make a positive act of the will to refuse to see it.

Kopp said...

If anything, Benedict is turning away from papal primacy and transforming the See of Peter into a constitutional monarchy.

How do you justify this statement when the FACT is that during the worldwide Bishops' Synod on the Eucharist, the issue of broader use of the old Latin rite was barely mentioned and there was a clear consensus that there was no need for concessions to the traditionalists or any form of liturgical renewal?

If the Pope was acting in the collegial footsteps of his predecesscor, that would have been the end of it, period, no further discussion.

The FACT that the Pope is doing this against almost universal resistance, and sending out shock troops to enforce it ahead of its publication, proves not only how nonsensical your assertions really are, but that the Pope is announcing "the end of collegiality as we know it.".

Anonymous said...

Yea, right, Mr. Kopp: the Pope displays his grip on the ecclesial scene by permitting various bishops and their Catholic Charities to refer prospective "gay" adoptees of children to state agencies. Or how about the bishops of Connecticut and Wisconsin permitting the distribution of morning-after abortifacients to rape victims in their Catholic hospitals. Both of these were examples of "compromise" with state agencies rather than suffering the loss of their state funding.

Things are out of control -- certainly not Benedict's fault. But please DON'T insult the intelligence of this board by telling us that these papal emissaries are being sent to read the riot act to dissenting bishops.

Br. Anthony said...

Dr. Kopp,

I hope that you are right. I am tired of bishops disobeying the pope, unless of course the disobedience is justified (i.e., the bishops of the SSPX).

Anonymous said...

Mr. Kopp, my response to your responses:

(1)"Yeah, right. When was the last time a Pope sent out shock troops to tell recalcitrant bishops that they may no longer disobey a clear Vatican directive?"

This statement assumes that the pope is sending the "experts" as "shock troops." The tone of Bishop Fellay's comments was that they were being sent as a way of trying to allay the fears of these bishops -- not to tell them that dissent was no longer permissable.

(2)Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos gave an appeal about the traditional Latin Mass at the Synod on the Eucharist. It's appearance out of nowhere, at the time, was attributed to the fact that he was putting his two cents into the discussion for the Pope to use later.

However, you did not respond directly to my observation that it is difficult to sustain your assertion that collegiality is over when just this past week the Pope announced that from now on the Synod of Bishops would go from being an advisory body to the Pope to a deliberative body on certain issues (albeit with his approval).

It would seem that your response to me on this point was a non-sequiter.

Anonymous said...

Pardon the typo: Make that "non sequitur."

Anonymous said...

Some recent discussion threads - not this one so far - seem to show a false idea of obedience. I recommend reading the authoritative treatment by the Angelic Doctor, which I attempt to summarize thus: 1, obedience to all commands which are neither unjust nor sinful (this level of obedience is necessary to salvation); 2, perfect obedience which means obedience to all commands, just or not, which are not sinful (I think some Religious bind themselves to their superiors by vows of perfect obedience); and 3, indiscrete (sinful, blind) obedience to all commands, even sinful ones. We sheep should not need to know these distinctions, but these are evil times so we need to know.

Kopp said...

during the worldwide Bishops' Synod on the Eucharist, the issue of broader use of the old Latin rite was barely mentioned and there was a clear consensus that there was no need for concessions to the traditionalists or any form of liturgical renewal?

I was not able to link it in my post above to give proper credit, but this fact was pointed out today on TheNewLiturgicalMovement blog in an article by Christopher Pearson, Amassing cause for change,

Stu said...

"I hope that you are right. I am tired of bishops disobeying the pope, unless of course the disobedience is justified (i.e., the bishops of the SSPX)."

Thanks for the chuckle. :)

Whatever it takes, I am happy with and trust the Holy Father's judgment on this. Regardless of when the MP is released, momentum is already building in favor of the Old Mass. His will be done!

techno_aesthete said...

"Its the end of collegiality as we know it."

A paraphrase of the lyric by R.E.M.

Kopp said...

"Its the end of collegiality as we know it."

A paraphrase of the lyric by R.E.M.


I'm glad somebody caught that. Now who hear is good at song parody lyrics?

John L said...

Don't overestimate the extent to which bishops have any sort of theological commitments at all. Lots of them are primarily motivated by what it looks like the man in charge approves of, because that is what will advance their careers. If it gets through their heads that the Pope is seriously committed to the old mass and is willing to defy opposition to promote it, many of them will find a new toleration or even enthusiasm for it.

Anonymous said...

And I have to ask just what is it the Pope is so frightened of that everytime some group of bishops gets uppity he has to delay his plans and spend more time trying to massage the egos of these crybabies? He has to consider that this is becoming a delaying tactic, a sick game to those bishops who don't want the motu proprio. Which conference is next after Germany? Will he have to send experts to every diocese in the U.S. to convince these reprobates? I am beginning to fear that Pope Benedict will not live long enough to do this and that that is really the plan now.

It is your own will Pope Benedict. Just do it now and deal with the problems afterwards. For God's sake, show us some leadership, please.

poeta said...

The Epistle for the feast of St. Pius V (from I Pet. 5) says:

Pascite qui in vobis est gregem Dei, providentes non ... ut dominantes in cleris, sed forma facti gregis ex animo.

"Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking care of it, not ... as lording it over the clergy, but being made a pattern of the flock from the heart."

Perhaps this passage is in his mind. Not to say that some measure of lordship isn't called for here, but nobody has accused His Holiness of changing his mind about ultimately doing this.

I wonder if the German bishops are jealous because they didn't get a phone call like the French.

Jordan Potter said...

"Or how about the bishops of Connecticut and Wisconsin permitting the distribution of morning-after abortifacients to rape victims in their Catholic hospitals."

Not to derail this discussion onto a side-rail, but the 1995 "Peoria protocol" (named for the diocese where Catholic bioethicists developed and first implemented it) isn't just approved by the bishops of Connecticut and Wisconsin, but by most U.S. bishops, especially in those states where the law forces all hospitals to dispense the so-called morning after pill. Directive 36 of the USCCB's "Ethical and Religious Directives for Catholic Health Care Services" says, "A female who has been raped should be able to defend herself against a potential conception from the sexual assault," and, "If, after appropriate testing, there is no evidence that conception has occurred already, (the victim) may be treated with medications that would prevent ovulation, sperm capacitation, or fertilization. It is not permissible, however, to initiate or to recommend treatments that have as their purpose or direct effect the removal, destruction, or interference with the implantation of a fertilized ovum."

In this context, the problem with the morning after pill is that, with the current state of our medical knowledge, it is not clear if and when it has an abortifacient effect. If it is sometimes abortifacient and we cannot be sure when it is and when it isn't, then to be safe Catholic hospitals must never prescribe it, regardless of what the law says they must do. In many states, that will mean a lot of legal struggles to save our hospitals, or else it will mean the end of Catholic health care in that state (which is, of course, exactly what the proponents of contraception and abortion want).

Of course I understand if this off-topic post is deleted. . . .

Anonymous said...

Kopp,

To say that it is the end to collegiality is huge leap and an indication that you have an attitude of dopey giddiness instead of calm level headedness towards the release of the motu proprio.
Oh anD just b/c people don't share the same dopey giddiness you have does not mean they are all doom and gloom or against the pope of against the release of the motu proprio. It's called being prudent and calm. The release of the motu proprio will in all liklihood be the turning of the tide, but that does not mean it will be sunshines and rainbows as you make it out to be. You're setting yourself up for a huge temper tantrum in the future if things don't exactly the way you expect it. That doesn't mean that the bad guys are gonna win, but it doesn't mean that the pope or any fture popes aren not gonna make mistakes in the future. Despite the freeing of the Mass and all the good intentions and good fruits that will come of it, the pope and the hierarchy in Rome will still be trying to serve 2 masters, Christ and the world. This is going to be a long and hard fought battle over the faith itself.

Anonymous said...

I love the Pope, His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI and pray and make sacrifice for him daily.
A true love demands looking at facts and at the truth. The Holy Father has cast official doubt on the infallible dogma of Limbo on the 2nd anniversary of his election. As de facto leader of the Church, at the funeral of His predecessor, he gave communion in the hand to a man who claimed a "Catholicism" so immanent that it did not conflict one bit with his protestantism. His much-awaited letter on the Eucharist did nothing to address the sacrileges of communion in the hand, which have led to the Sacred Host being sold on e-bay, and Demonic cults in Rome itself boasting of a financial premium for Hosts consecrated by the Pope for use in their black masses. In fact, the letter promoted intercommunion with heretics. This sadly is what the facts clearly state about the Holy Father's agenda and ideas. The ancient Mass appears only to be a secondary priority and again only with an intention to life-belt a sinking Church while He continues to push the most modernist and radical of actions to, in His words as Cardinal Ratzinger, "take down the Catholic bastions of the Church". Meanwhile, the world all around the CHurch is ablaze in murder and Anti-Christ is on rise, even by the standards of the Vatican's most senior advisors. 70 years after the French revolution dealt a fatal blow to the Catholic state, Our Lady of Lourdes appeared to convince the Church that the solution was Her Immaculate Conception. Almost 70 years after that, She appeared at Fatima to re-iterate that Her Immaculate Heart was the answer. Pope Ratzinger needs to convert from believing that "an immaculate heart" is simply one that does God's will, to believing in the One Immaculate Heart of the Ark of the New Covenant, who alone will save us from this Mess.

Pray much for the Holy Father!

Jeff said...

"The Holy Father has cast official doubt on the infallible dogma of Limbo on the 2nd anniversary of his election."

Oh, for heaven's sake!

Even Fr. Harrison's wonderful and erudite piece for the Seattle Catholic says

"In short, while Limbo as distinct from very mild hellfire was a 'hypothetical' destiny for unbaptized infants, their eternal exclusion from Heaven (with or without any 'pain of sense') — at least after the proclamation of the Gospel, and apart from the 'baptism of blood' of infants slaughtered out of hatred for Christ — this was traditional Catholic doctrine, not a mere hypothesis. No, it was never dogmatically defined. But the only question is whether the doctrine was infallible by virtue of the universal and ordinary magisterium, or merely "authentic".

According to Harrison, the teaching that unbaptized babies do not go to heaven may be infallible or it may not.

The Pope's minimal gesture in the direction of favor shown to the reoopening of a theological discussion on the question is a teeny-tiny drop on the 'merely "authentic"' side of the scales.