An interview with Christian Marquant, of French association Paix Liturgique:
Paix Liturgique – Dear Christian, what do you mean by the title you chose for this interview?
Christian Marquant – That the motu proprio Traditionis Custodes, which was published exactly four years ago on July 16, 2021, was an extraordinary exercise of manipulation aimed at putting and end once and for all to the increasingly disturbing question of the renewal of those who are known as traditionalists, and whom I prefer to call faithful Catholics.
Paix Liturgique – But why do you call it manipulation?
Christian Marquant – Quite simply because this motu proprio was not a decision taken in light of reality but it was nothing else than a low blow based on a deliberate lie.
Paix Liturgique – What deliberate lie would that be?
Christian Marquant – One only has to read the text of the motu proprio to understand it… Indeed, it is presented as a response to the results of a survey conducted by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith among the bishops of the Latin Church aimed at obtaining their opinions some ten years after the decision – and implementation – of the motu proprio Summorum Pontificum, issued by Pope Benedict XVI on July 7, 2007.
Paix Liturgique – But did this survey pose a problem?
Christian Marquant – Not at all! It was even requested by the motu proprio SP that it should take place after a certain time, a sort of assessment, or rather an analysis of the effects of this decision.
Paix Liturgique – But where is the problem then?
Christian Marquant – It is not in the fully legitimate survey which was conducted, but rather in the interpretation of the responses that ensued...
Paix Liturgique – And what was this interpretation?
Christian Marquant – That for the majority of the bishops who spoke out, the application of Summorum Pontificum posed a serious problem for the future of the Unity of the Church; which, of course, had the effect of suspending its application to protect this supposedly endangered unity.
Paix Liturgique – But then…
Christian Marquant – The real tragedy of this manipulation was that the "appreciation" of this investigation that was officially made in Rome did not correspond to the reality…
Paix Liturgique – How do you know that?
Christian Marquant – It turns out that there were a few leaks within Cardinal Ladaria's entourage that allowed me to gain access in 2020 to the true summary of the survey... which, far from suggesting that the application of Summorum Pontificum posed a risk to the unity of the Church, affirmed that the vast majority of bishops who responded (and there were a very large number who participated compared to other surveys of the same type conducted by the Holy See in recent years) had done so in a peaceful spirit and declared themselves largely in favour of the decision taken by Benedict XVI. Moreover, what I had read was confirmed by a subsequent article of Diane Montana, who must also have been aware of the summary, but especially by a forthcoming book written by Father Nicola Bux and Saverio Gaeta, of which I will speak afterwards.
Paix Liturgique – But then, who might have been responsible for this manipulation?
Christian Marquant – The enemies of peace! Because they understood that by using malice and, of course, dishonesty, they had a chance, and actually perhaps the very last chance to derail the work of reconciliation initiated by Benedict XVI in 2007.
Paix Liturgique – Is it possible?
Christian Marquant – There had already been a French precedent for this type of manipulation on the part of certain French bishops who, instead of allowing each pastor to answer according to his own conscience, had tried to propose to Rome a collective response that was, of course, very negative.
Paix Liturgique – How do you know?
Christian Marquant – If the enemies of peace do exist, there are also just and honest men at all levels of the Church who are scandalized by the deceitfulness of the wicked. Thus, we had the negative synthesis in our hands as quickly as those for whom it was written, and we published it (Link to Letter 761), demonstrating its deceptive nature.
Paix Liturgique – But could there also be people in Rome who were ready and willing to act dishonestly to harm the revival of the traditional movement?
Christian Marquant – But of course, also in Rome… where the enemies of peace discovered in 2018/2019 that the traditional revival was becoming a real problem for the future of their heretical projects.
Paix Liturgique – What revival would that be?
Christian Marquant – The one revealed by our multiple surveys, according to which, in every country in the world, at least a third of the practicing Catholics (or even non-practicing, for that matter) declared that if given the choice, they would prefer to live their Catholic faith to the rhythm of the traditional liturgy and catechism.
Paix Liturgique – But did this have any real consequences?
Christian Marquant – The enemies of peace were also aware of this reality and they had done everything they could to deny it with their incessant slogan, "They don't exist", , but unfortunately for them, that reality ended up being strikingly reaffirmed by the almost universal development of the traditional liturgy in the years 2020.
Paix Liturgique – A universal development?
Christian Marquant – Absolutely, because if for decades the enemies of peace liked to repeat that the traditional Mass only had defenders in France and then in the United States, they were then forced to note that in 2019 the traditional Mass was vigorously developing in more than 90 countries around the world.
Paix Liturgique – In more than 90 countries…
Christian Marquant – That was in 2019 because today, in 2025, despite Traditionis Custodes, the traditional liturgy is now celebrated in more than 100 countries. It is this "traditional" contagion that the enemies of peace feared.
Paix Liturgique – A Traditional Contagion?
Christian Marquant – Of course, because for a huge part of the faithful, the liturgical-catechetical broth offered to them by a lukewarm church seems tasteless, flavourless, and soulless. And by simple common sense, the holiness and catholicity of the traditional liturgy and its corollary, the traditional catechism, is bound to satisfy the curiosity and spiritual appetite of the faithful, but also of many priests, both diocesan and religious… especially in the internet age.
Paix Liturgique – How does the internet play a role in this matter?
Christian Marquant – It's very simple. With Internet, the publicity of facts, ideas, and information no longer has any limits, there are no barriers or boundaries any longer. If one is curious enough, it is now possible to discover the Catholic faith online from anywhere in the world... which wasn't true 50, 40, 30, or even 20 years ago, when this information was blocked by the enemies of Peace. From then on, a veritable trail of Catholic fire spreads to all the peoples of the planet, generating an unlimited development of the traditional liturgy, and this is undoubtedly what began to frighten the enemies of Peace...
Paix Liturgique – And that's why they decided to enact this odious manipulation?
Christian Marquant – Absolutely, because in my opinion, they sensed it was their last chance, i.e., they felt they had to take advantage of the pontificate of an aging Francis.
Paix Liturgique - But wasn’t it Pope Francis who signed these texts based on a false interpretation of the bishops' survey?
Christian Marquant – I don't think Pope Francis, who had often been ambiguous on this subject, was the source of this fraud; but let's say that he was actually duped by some of his entourage who led him to believe that the traditional world, which even if it didn't really exist, was beginning to become a danger to the Church and that a strong show of authority would make it disappear.
Paix Liturgique - Hardly believable! How could they have hoped it would work?
Christian Marquant – Remember Father Paul-Adrien's video: "Come on guys, stop playing around now, you have to obey and fall into line." It's probably in this sense that Francis, who probably wasn't the one behind this low blow, nevertheless let things happen.
Paix Liturgique – But there was more than that, since the Pope sided with the bad guys at least twice.
Christian Marquant – Indeed, and especially during his meeting with the Slovak Jesuits.
Paix Liturgique - But the most violent blows came from the strange Cardinal Roche...
Christian Marquant – Cardinal Roche undoubtedly tried to outwit the Pope, but it wasn't in Francis's character to accept being manipulated, and what happened next is quite revealing.
Paix Liturgique - What happened next?
Christian Marquant – That the Pope ended up receiving representatives of traditional religious communities and allowed them to pursue their charisms, which was in itself a huge snub to the enemies of Peace who had tried to manipulate him.
Paix Liturgique - But who were these enemies of Peace?
Christian Marquant – These enemies of peace fall into several categories. There are, of course, prelates from what is called "the St. Gallen mafia", who, behind the scenes, have been pulling the strings of neo-modernism for decades. But we also published numerous documents at the time of the conclave that illustrate the hostile actions against a return to traditional forms in the Church by Cardinals Ouellet and Parolin, as well as Bishop Viola, the secretary of the congregation, a very hostile figure. But these chess players, these string-pullers, are by nature discreet men, men of the shadows who prefer to let lay people, less vulnerable and, above all, much freer than themselves, take center stage.
Paix Liturgique – Do you have some examples?
Christian Marquant – I'll limit myself to just one, Andrea Grillo, Professor at the Pontifical Athenaeum of Saint Anselm in Rome
Paix Liturgique – The same Grillo you recently mentioned regarding his criticism of the canonization of Carlo Acutis, and the same one who even more recently criticized Pope Leo XIV on the subject of the Corpus Christi procession?
Christian Marquant – The one and the same, but we must remember that Professor Andrea Grillo is no spring chicken. For many years, this figure, who nevertheless remains a free electron within the Pontifical Athenaeum of Saint Anselm, has publicly manoeuvred against all peace initiatives, particularly those that would restore "normal" status to the traditional missal.
Paix Liturgique – But yet Pope Francis had given assurances of peace to the Priestly Society of Saint Pius X?
Christian Marquant – That is exactly what I stated previously, and I would like to point out that the Holy Father, and even Pope Francis, have been forced to acknowledge that the enemies of peace have no other objective than to do everything possible to completely eliminate any return to tradition, and even any survival of tradition.
Paix Liturgique – How do you see the future?
Christian Marquant – Allow me to answer in a general and comprehensive manner, not circumstantially.
Paix Liturgique – That is to say, independently of the new Supreme Pontiff...
Christian Marquant – Absolutely. So allow me to make a fairly straightforward observation: the modernist church, which is more proper to the West, is agonizing, desperate, almost dead...
Paix Liturgique – We can clearly see this in the spectacular drop in vocations.
Christian Marquant – However, think again, because for the modernists, for the enemies of Peace, the drop in vocations is not a problem, and even more, they would quite happily live with a church without priests. No, their main problem is a question of resources and money. One only has to examine the balance sheets of dioceses, like those of the Vatican, to see that this is THEIR REAL PROBLEM.
Paix Liturgique – Why?
Christian Marquant – It's very simple: for the enemies of Peace, a lack of money means no more resources to support their institution, no more resources to hire lay or religious auxiliaries, no more resources to secure a place in the world of communication and the internet.
Paix Liturgique – But perhaps they still have some faithful?
Christian Marquant – How many faithful do they have left when religious practice has fallen from 25% to less than 2% in 50 years, and it's important to realize that the fewer the faithful, the more numerous the silent ones—that is, the crypto-traditionalists—are.
Paix Liturgique – But in France, for example, nearly 20% of children are educated in officially Catholic schools.
Christian Marquant – But most of them are no longer Catholic or very little so.
Paix Liturgique – But then, what can we expect from the future?
Christian Marquant – Traditionis Custodes has shown its limits, and I dare to hope that even if this odious text were not repealed, it will certainly be forgotten. Meanwhile, the traditional world, which has not suffered much from Traditionis Custodes, will continue to develop and grow, undoubtedly with greater benevolence from certain bishops and why not from the Holy Father himself.
Paix Liturgique – From the Holy Father himself?
Christian Marquant – You see, one day our pastors will have to end up loving us as we are, and then they’ll have to act accordingly. When Francis repeats TODOS, TODOS, TODOS, like a mantra, common sense would dictate that it has at least some meaning. And when Leo XIV begins his pontificate with the word "Peace," we can hope as Catholics that this will have at least some kind of meaning, and this could of course lead to a change of attitude on the part of the Pope and the bishops who would simply allow us to live our Catholic Faith peacefully and completely to the rhythm of the traditional liturgy, the traditional catechism, that is, the two-thousand-year-old traditional faith of the Church of Christ.
Paix Liturgique – One last question: your entire analysis of the situation and of what’s to come in the future is based on your conviction that Traditionis Custodes was established based on the manipulation of the results of the survey conducted among the bishops, but is this certain?
Christian Marquant – To answer your question, I might conclude by giving you some very good news: the summary of the survey, with all its results, will be published in a few months and will be presented at the next Pax Liturgica meeting, which will take place in Rome on the eve of our 14th Summorum Pontificum pilgrimage. A first notable element is the high response rate, around 35%, well above the usual average for questionnaires sent to bishops. We can draw a preliminary conclusion: bishops around the world feel concerned by the question of the traditional Mass and they desire Paix Liturgique, Liturgical Peace. [Source]
