Rorate Caeli

Aparecida Notes: Castrillón to Bishops of Latin America
Pope wishes to "extend the possible use of the 1962 books to all Latin Church"

Cardinal Castrillón Hoyos, President of the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei and a member of the Fifth General Conference of Latin American Bishops, delivered the following address yesterday in Aparecida (in Spanish):

Card. Darío Castrillón Hoyos
President Ecclesia Dei
Aparecida, May 14, 2007

[Delivered in Aparecida, May 16, 2007]

Dear and Venerable Brothers,

I allow myself to present a brief information on the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei and on the state of the pastoral reality which the Holy Father has placed under its competence.

This Commission was created by the Servant of God John Paul II in 1988, when a notable group of priests, religious, and faithful, who had made manifest their discontent with the Conciliar liturgical reform and who had congregated themselves under the leadership of French Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, separated themselves from him because they were not in agreement with the schismatic action of the ordination of Bishops without the appropriate pontifical mandate. They preferred, therefore, to stay in full union with the Church. The Holy Father, by way of the Motu Proprio Ecclesia Dei Adflicta, entrusted the pastoral care of these Traditionalist faithful to this Commission.

Nowadays, the activity of the Commission is not limited to the service of those faithful who, at that time, wished to remain in full communion with the Church, nor to the efforts made to put an end to the painful schismatic situation and to attain the return of these brothers of the Saint Pius X fraternity to full communion. By the will of the Holy Father, this Dicastery extends its service, moreover, to satisfy the just aspirations of those who, due to a particular sensibility, and not having kept links to the above-mentioned groups, wish to keep alive the ancient Latin Liturgy in the celebration of the Eucharist and of the other Sacraments.

Undoubtedly, the most important effort, which concerns the entire Church, is the search for an end to the schismatic action and to rebuild the full communion, without ambiguities. The Holy Father, who was for some years a member of this Commission, wishes it to become an organ of the Holy See with the proper and distinct end of preserving and maintaining the worth of the Traditional Latin Liturgy. Yet it must be said with all clarity that it is not a turning back, a return to the time before the 1970 reform. It is, instead, a generous offer of the Vicar of Christ who, as an expression of his pastoral will, wishes to put at the disposal of the whole Church all the treasures of the Latin Liturgy which for centuries has nourished the spiritual life of so many generations of Catholic faithful.The Holy Father wishes to preserve the immense spiritual, cultural, and aesthetic treasures linked to the Ancient Liturgy. The retrieval of this wealth is linked to the no less precious one of the current Liturgy of the Church.

For these reasons, the Holy Father has the intention of extending to the entire Latin Church the possibility of celebrating Holy Mass and the Sacraments according to the liturgical books promulgated by Blessed John XXIII in 1962. There is today a new and renewed interest for this liturgy, which has never been abolished and which, as we have said, is considered a treasure, and also for this reason [the interest] the Holy Father believes that the time has come to ease, as the first Cardinalatial Commission of 1986 had wished to do, the access to this liturgy, making it an extraordinary form of the one Roman Rite.

There are good experiences of communities of religious or apostolic life recently erected by the Holy See which celebrate this liturgy in peace and serenity. Groups of faithful who attend these celebrations with joy and gratitude assemble around them. The most recent establishments are the Institute of Saint Philip Neri, in Berlin, which functions as an Oratory, and which is also present, and well received, in the Diocese of Trier; the Institute of the Good Shepherd, of Bordeaux, which gathers together priests, seminarians, and faithful, some of them from the Fraternity of Saint Pius X. The proceedings for the recognition of a contemplative community, the Oasis of Jesus Priest, of Barcelona, are well advanced.

In Latin America, as is well known, we must thank the Lord for the return of a whole diocese, that of Campos, Lefebvrian in the past, which now, after five years, presents good fruits. It was a peaceful return and the faithful who have enrolled themselves in the Apostolic Administration are glad to be able to live in peace in their parochial communities; furthermore, in effect, some Brazilian dioceses have made contacts with the Campos Apostolic Administration, which has placed priests at their disposal for the pastoral care of the Traditionalist faithful in their local churches. The Holy Father's project has been partly proved in Campos, where the peaceful cohabitation of the forms of the only Roman Rite in the Church is a beautiful reality. We have the hope that this model will yield good fruits, also in other places of the Church where Catholic faithful with diverse liturgical sensibilities live together. And we hope, furthermore, that this way of living together will also attract those Traditionalists which still remain far away.

The current members of the Commission are Cardinals Julián Herranz, Jean-Pierre Ricard, William Joseph Levada, Antonio Cañizares, and Franc Rodé. Its consultants are the Undersecretaries of some Dicasteries.

Several communities spread throughout the world have been up to now under Ecclesia Dei. 300 priests, 79 religious men, 300 religious women, 200 seminarians, and several hundreds of thousands of faithful. The interest of the young curiously increases in France, the United States, Brazil, Italy, Scandinavia, Australia, and China. At the moment of its return, 50 priests, around 50 seminarians, 100 religious women, and 25,000 faithful came from Campos.

Today, the group of the Lefebvrians includes 4 Bishops who were ordained by Mons. Lefebvre, 500 priests, and 600,000 faithful. Several contemplative monasteries, and some male and female religious groups have joined the group, which has parishes (they call them priories), seminaries, and associations. They are present in 26 countries.

Let us ask the Lord that this project of the Holy Father may soon be accomplished for the unity of the Church.

There are, naturally, several extremely important aspects in the Cardinal's address in Aparecida. For those who remained skeptical (are there any left?), another confirmation of the Holy Father's determined will to "extend to the entire Latin Church" the celebration of Holy Mass (and all other Sacraments) according to the 1962 liturgical books. While that merely confirms the clear words of Cardinal Bertone, it is quite an improvement for Castrillón who until very recently still presented the matter as probable, not as certain -- as he clearly does in his Aparecida speech.

The address also confirms, for those who still had any doubts about its existence and findings (which had been confirmed by one of its members, but in a more informal setting), that the Cardinalatial Commission of 1986 recommended that the restrictions on the Traditional Rite of the Church be eased. Naturally, it is extremely frustrating to once again see that such an important step could have been taken 21 years ago, and could have preserved so many priests and faithful from so much pain...

Nonetheless, Pope Benedict seems quite determined to accomplish this which could be the most important act of his pontificate: the establishment (out of his own will, motu proprio) of a clear legal framework for the "Extraordinary Form of the Roman Rite".

[Thanks to all who sent us the same link]


  1. Anonymous10:48 AM

    "The retrieval of this wealth is linked to the no less precious one of the current Liturgy of the Church". Oh dear!

  2. Anonymous10:55 AM

    Very good news though, all the same.

  3. Anonymous10:58 AM

    Excellent! His Emminence hits every point on the Traditional Mass and, dare I say, implies the Motu Proprio's release in the near NEAR future.

  4. Anonymous2:01 PM

    "Nowadays, the activity of the Commission is not limited to the service of those faithful who, at that time, wished to remain in full communion with the Church, nor to the efforts made to put an end to the painful schismatic situation and to attain the return of these brothers of the Saint Pius X fraternity to full communion."

    Now people put every comment like this of Cardinal Hoyos under a microscope. He does not seem to be saying here that the SSPX is in an "irregular canonical situation", but that in fact they are not in full communion with the Roman Catholic Church. Perhaps he is just referring to the Bishops, but he seems to be referring to the Society as a whole, including all of the priests and laity.

    "The interest of the young curiously increases in France, the United States, Brazil, Italy, Scandinavia, Australia, and China."

    There is nothing curious at all about the interest of the young in the traditional Mass and Sacraments. It is curious only if you are in denial about the current state of the Church.

  5. Anonymous2:41 PM

    While this speech once again confirms that the "liberalization" of the Ancient Mass is imminent, for which every true Catholic should be most grateful to the Holy Hearts of Jesus and Mary, we need to be pragmatic about the overall situation being rendered here. The Cardinal uses the word "schismatic" in reference to the SSPX no less than 3 times, although he qualifies the use to the "action" of Arch Lefebvre, while insinuating that the society as a whole is still not in "full" communion, or in "communion" but with "ambiguities". He refers to Pope John XXIII as Blessed, and makes it very clear that this is not a step to go "back" to the time prior to 1970. What that means is anyone's guess. Going back to what the Cardinal does not explain. This should concern us all because faithful Catholics are not looking to go "back" to anything except that which should not have been restricted in the first place, namely, Sacred Tradition in its fullest dogmatic and liturgical expression. The reference to Campos, in light of the unacceptable compromises carried out by Campos leadership in the last 3 years, allowing their priests to celebrate the Novus Ordo, is also a troubling sign. Will the Ancient Mass be liberalized with conditions? Nonetheless, one can perhaps empathize with the Holy Father on the level of prudence - that despite the modernist hatred and fear of the Ancient Mass being unjustified, it is there, and to secure as much obedience as these heretical and disobedient bishops will allow themselves to conjure, perhaps this is the only way out for him. No one can judge the Holy Father, except a future Pope or council, but while offering a smidgeon of hope this speech does concern me considerably. Our Lady of Fatima, pray for us!

  6. The time has come for Rome to come back completely to Tradition. The battle for Tradition will not be over until the Novus Ordo Missae and Vatican II are gathered as dirt and placed in the dustbin of Church history. The Tridentine rite is the ONLY rite of the Roman Rite and will always be so. Anybody who thinks otherwise is fighting on the wrong side of the battle.

  7. Br. Anthony
    I don't think that will happen in our lifetimes. In order to do that, some of the powers in the Church would have to give up some of their legitimacy, and admit to staggering error either on their own part, or that of the previous holder of their office. So, the NO will not be outlawed, or even discouraged. It will be for a while the default rite, then for another while a common rite. In perhaps 50 or 60 years it will become rare, and in a few centuries it will be lost, but not outlawed.

  8. Some have asked me about the word "curiously" as a translation for "curiosamente" in, "The interest of the young curiously increases in France, the United States, Brazil, Italy, Scandinavia, Australia, and China." It is the safest (literal) option for the word, which could also be translated as "oddly", "interestingly", or even "peculiarly" or "strangely".

    The general "curiousness" of the situation for those who are unfamiliar with the Traditionalist faithful is the fact that young people would be interested in the Traditional Roman Rite, which still seems odd to many bishops.

  9. Danby,

    It may indeed not happen in our lifetime, but fight will be passed on to future generations. How do you think the Freemasons obtained their goals? By the same way.

  10. Anonymous3:55 PM

    The Holy Father, who was for some years a member of this Commission, wishes it to become an organ of the Holy See with the proper and distinct end of preserving and maintaining the worth of the Traditional Latin Liturgy.

    A new status and mission for the Ecclesia Dei Commision? Preserving and maintaining as opposed to containing, perhaps?

  11. Anonymous3:56 PM

    Anonymous writes:
    He refers to Pope John XXIII as Blessed

    That's how one generally refers to the beati.

  12. This motu proprio, should it ever be released, may have so many limiting conditions attached to it, that many of traditional Latin rite Catholics, to whom, essentially, it is offered, will simply reject it out of hand.

  13. Anonymous5:01 PM

    "while insinuating that the society as a whole is still not in 'full' communion, or in 'communion' but with 'ambiguities'."

    If the SSPX were in full communion, there wouldn't be any need for the Holy See to work to bring about a reconciliation with them, would it?

    "He refers to Pope John XXIII as Blessed"

    As dcs has observed, since John XXIII has been beatified, he is Blessed John XXIII.

  14. Anonymous6:24 PM

    To Jordan Potter's comments "If the SSPX were in full communion, there wouldn't be any need for the Holy See to work to bring about a reconciliation with them, would it?"

    Not quite. The SSPX has been confirmed by Cardinal Hoyos himself on two separate occasions not to be in schism. When asked why the same openness to dialogue that Rome has with for example the schismatic Eastern Orthodox is not available to the SSPX, his response was that the SSPX is an internal matter, in short, that the SSPX is in full communion with Rome. There is no partial communion in the body of Christ - you are either out of it, or part of it. If the SSPX were truly schismatic and in schism it would be out of the Church, and would need to be restored to communion. All of these partial qualifiers regarding communion on the part of Hoyos can only contribute further to the "ambiguities" he claims to lament. Call it the way it is Father, they're either in communion or they aren't. And if they aren't can't you at least treat them as nicely as the Eastern Orthodox and the Protestants. I've never heard a bishop in recent memory call the Eastern Orthodox "schismatic" - one imagines this would trample the ecumenical venture. But any time one of these bishops or Cardinals so much as breathes a whif of the SSPX, like bread and butter, the adjective "schismatic" is used. YOu can't have it both ways - either they are schismatic and out of the church, in which case, be consistent and pull all your ecumenical goodies out - such as donating Roman Churches to them, like Pope JP2 did to the Greek Orthodox Church in Time, and generally saying very nice and positive things and never ever calling them "schismatic" - or they are not schismatic, they are within the fold, and then you have a duty to treat them with fraternal love instead of libelling them falsely as "schismatics". Cardinal Hoyos displays either a remarkable lack of charity or clarity using the term "schismatic".

    To use the qualifier "schismatic" no less than 3 times when referring to a fraternal society he himself recognizes as "within the fold" as it were, is a clear sign of pandying to those who continue to wish to smear traditionalists at large.

    There certainly is a need for a formal understanding between Rome and the SSPX but not because there is no full communion or a partial communion with ambiguities. The SSPX prays and honors Pope Benedict XVI at every one of its Masses, as it did Pope John Paul II before him as the legitimate Vicars of Christ Himself. They are also obedient to him in all jurisdictional matters. Talk to any SSPXer involved in a marriage or an annulment proceeding. They have withheld an obedience solely to abandon the Ancient Mass - an obedience that would not serve The Faith. They have withheld obedience solely on the chimera of public "ecumenical" gestures that confuse the dogma of extra ecclesia nulla salus. In short, like St Paul towards St Peter Christians, they have avoided solely prudential orders - that are never infallible - that have been perceived to have caused grave harm to the faith of the Church.

    And for this reason, my personal opinion is that until the Holy Father embraces the SSPX for their fidelity to Traditional dogma and liturgy, and can at least admit that sound and faithful Catholics from 1976 (7 years after the liturgical changes came into effect and by which time their fruits became clear to many across the world, not the least of which was an abortion clinic underneath Pope Paul VIs nose in Rome) to the present can be quite easily understood for not buying into the devastating effects of the prudential decisions made by way of Vatican II and the 1969 Novus Ordo Missae, there is a real problem and cause for sober reflection and concern, albeit one tempered with a smidgeon of hope.

    I would be more hopeful if Vatican representatives talked about the need for talks with the SSPX without feeling the need to constantly throw the term "schismatic" around, a term they use very carelessly in a shocking lack of charity towards brethren who are in truth victims and not criminals.

    May Our Lady, Star of the Sea, guide the Holy Father towards reconciliation with the SSPX in a humble, charitable and penitential.

  15. Annonymous:

    I believe that you are correct in your assessment. Cardinal Hoyos seems to be trying to placate angry bishops re" the SSPX; hence the language in his address being soemwhat different than earlier statements.

    Br. Anthony, you are correct that for the Roman Church there is one rite. However, we must alos fight for the restoration of other western rites (also holy and venerable). Thus, there are other rites and usages within the "Roman" section of Christendom.

  16. Anonymous7:46 PM

    According to Pope Benedict, there are two rites within the Roman Church: the TLM and the NO. You are wrong, Br. Anthony. Pope Benedict wishes the NO to be the ordinary rite and the TLM to be the extraordinary rite.


  17. Anonymous8:10 PM

    Janice, I think it is more accurate to say that Pope Benedict sees, or would wish the Church to see, the TLM and NO and the extraordinary and the ordinary "forms" of the one Roman Rite, not two Roman Rites, one extraordinary and one ordinary.

    Anonymous, of course it's very commendable that the SSPX prays for the Holy Father and, nominally at least, recognises Benedict XVI as the legitimate pontiff. The problem is that they don't obey him, and do not at this time have any lawful, canonical right to offer the sacraments. As for the question of the degree of communion between the SSPX and the Catholic Church, you say that one is either in communion or not. But the Church sometimes speaks of Christians who have a partial or imperfect and deficient communion with her. It's difficult to see how a priestly fraternity that currently has no right to engage in sacramental ministry could be said to be in full communion with the Church. Else why all the efforts to reconcile the SSPX and regularise them?

  18. Anonymous9:22 PM

    I don't think the statement that young people's interest "curiously" increases is meant to be derogatory. It is simply the case that most bishops whom Castrillon was addressing do find this to be very curious indeed. Nonetheless, as the Cardinal points out, it is a fact.

  19. Anonymous9:24 PM

    Quite to the contrary Mr Potter.

    The Vatican responded formally to a question regarding sacramental ministry of the SSPX. In Hawaii, the bishop there claimed that anyone receiving sacraments from the SSPX was excommunicated. The formal response from the Vatican was that this was completely false. As such, the SSPX priests are well within their canonical rights to serve the faithful with the sacraments. They are not schismatic, and sacraments received within SSPX parishes at SSPX Masses are valid.

    Even the Vatican agrees with that.

    The Vatican calls the act of consecration of 4 bishops by Arch LEfebvre as a "schismatic act". In appearance at least because it involved disobeying a direct order from the Pontiff. But this so called "schismatic act" does not make the entire SSPX or any of its priests or faithful "schismatic", nor does it invalidate their sacraments in any way. And the question as to whether Arch Lefebvre's action was "schismatic", given that an act of disobedience is licit if grave harm to the faith of the Church is perceived in the act of obedience, even according to the Saints themselves, is one the Vatican needs to be more open to discussing in charity. Carelessly throwing out the term "schismatic" every time they refer to the faithful who are assisted sacramentally by the SSPX is uncharitable and calumnous. I hope Cardinal Hoyos gets over that terminology very quickly if he's serious about helping the Holy Father mend the rift.

    In JMJ.

  20. "And if they aren't can't you at least treat them as nicely as the Eastern Orthodox and the Protestants."

    Excellent, excellent point anon!

    It frustrates me to no end how otherwise solid, interesting neo-catholic apologists/ writers/ bloggers heap all sorts of scorn on the Society, calling them 'RadTrads' and such, while speaking so highly of our 'separated brethren.'

    Terms like and 'schismatic' seem solely resvered for certain traditionalist groups these days.

    Obviously, not everyone thinks/talks alike; it's just a general tendency I've noticed over the years..

  21. Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos' words contradict both these positions. According to him, it is the opinion of the Holy Father that there is one rite subsisting in two missals. Same thing, different version. I can live with that. It's like a great novel in full, and in an abridged version...with pictures. I'm not being unkind, just drawing the metaphor. As I say, I can live with it for the time being. Lets make if formal and publish the MP.

  22. Anonymous3:25 AM

    "As such, the SSPX priests are well within their canonical rights to serve the faithful with the sacraments."

    That's doesn't follow at all. Just because someone who receives SSPX sacraments is not necessarily excommunicate, that doesn't mean the SSPX priests are within their canonical rights to do something that the Church says they are not allowed to do.

    "They are not schismatic,"

    Perhaps so, but in any case they are not in full communion with the Church.

    "and sacraments received within SSPX parishes at SSPX Masses are valid."

    Except for the Sacrament of Penance, it is true that the SSPX sacraments are valid. However, since the SSPX priests have been suspended by the Church and therefore lack jurisdiction, objectively they cannot grant absolution. (I note, however, that you claim that the SSPX is obedient to the Pope in all jurisdictional matters.) Also, their Masses are illicit and therefore displeasing to God at least as much as the illicit innovations and liturgical abuses that are rampant in Pauline Masses. I'm afraid that, though it is understandable why the SSPX holds itself exempt from the obedience and docility that are required of Catholics, nevertheless this is a case of trying to make a right out of two wrongs.

  23. Anonymous9:37 AM

    This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  24. Anonymous10:29 AM

    On one hand they say that the NO was designed to be more like the early worship of the Church.. and then they say that we can't go back to a previous form of worship... ie the TLM... which is it?

    Will W.

  25. Anonymous3:42 PM

    What is obvious is that there exist to worlds of Catholicism today. Roman Catholicism which incorporates the whole of the Church 33-1965, and then Vatican2, which wanders from 1965 to the present trying to find its new self in the world while meticulously engendering in the minds of the innocent that the path Vatican2 is but that same path as has always been, but suited for modern man's thinking. Ludicrous, no! The Church reveals itself in its Sacredness by its steadfast, and unyielding of Catholic truth, supported by Fathers of the Church, Doctors, Martyrs, Councils to fortify the presence of Jesus Christ through this great mystical Body, and the unchanging liturgy(Sacrifice of the Mass, full and complete under St. Pius V). Vatican2 is the new Arianism of the modern world. Truly Pharisaical in nature. Deviant, and coated most astutely by logic seemingly kind, generous, and true. To say the modern Church has not been infiltrated for its destruction, only a fool would say "nay!" The red garbed Princes' in Rome are for the most part cowards, and their duped followers, slaves to lies, and deception!

  26. Anonymous4:50 PM

    "Roman Catholicism which incorporates the whole of the Church 33-1965, and then Vatican2, which wanders from 1965 to the present"

    It sounds like you're saying that the Church formally defected from the faith in 1965, after which the only real Catholics left are a scattered nearly-underground remnant of Vatican II-rejecting true believers. Hopefully you do not really adhere to such un-Catholic beliefs.

  27. Excellent speech by Cardinal Castrillón Hoyos. I think that the greatest challange to the Tridentine Rite will in Latin America, since those clerics who are still very much attached to the heretic liberation theology see the pre-conciliar liturgy as a representation of all that they hate of the Catholic Church and an obstacle to their evil desires of destroying the Catholic Church.

  28. Givwn that the discussion has turned towards reflections on the NO liturgy, let us reflect on Cardinal Ratzinger's thoughts:


    "What happened at the Council was something else entirely: in the place of the liturgy as the fruit of development came fabricated liturgy. We abandoned the organic, living, process of growth and development over centuries, and replaced it - as in a manufacturing process - with a fabrication, a banal on-the-spot product."

    Joseph Ratzinger (1993). From the preface to the French edition of "Reforms of the Roman Liturgy Its Problems and Background"

  29. What does Cardinal Castrillón Hoyos mean when he says that there will not be a return to the past? Does the past exist in the Catholic Church, as if something different from what the present is? Or is he saying that the Church will continue to recognize Vatican II as an excercise of the Magisterium of the Church, as oppossed to the SSPX that does not recognize Vatican II as an expression of the Magisterium of the Church?

  30. Anonymous1:42 AM

    Arianism is a historical fact of the Church. 80% of the Bishops at that time subscribed to it. I would say that 75% of our Bishops subscribe to modernism, which is also a heresy. Only God can judge their hearts. "They may have our churches, but we have the faith." Indeed, if one walks into many of the once-Orthodox Catholic churches in the world today, one is met with a form and practice our Catholic forefathers would have found blasphemous.

    The greater question is this: is the Eucharist validly consecrated at a modernist mass? I would say Yes. Moreover, I would even venture to say that the Eucharist was validly consecrated at an Arian mass. God may supercede a heretical priest or bishop to Himself shepherd His faithful. All of us can't fly 1,000 miles to attend a perfectly faithful mass. God will watch over those of His faithful who have their hearts in the right place and try to remain true to the Traditional Church.

  31. Anonymous11:10 AM

    *wild cheer*
    Wohoo, the Cardinal mentioned Scandinavia! (That would be us)

  32. An interesting take by Bishop Fellay on the Moto Proprio

  33. Anonymous1:33 AM

    vTHE Roman Missal prior to 1962 should be used. The True Mass (Traditional Latin Mass) needs no release. No validly ordained Catholic priest needs permission to do the True Mass. The True Mass can never be legally forbidden. All the fuss about the True Mass is revealing who is truly Catholic and who is not (and those people sadly don't even know it).

  34. Anonymous2:50 PM

    As one who has great sympathy for and supports the aims of the Fratenal Society of Saint Pius the tenth as the flagship of Orthodoxy since the aborrations in the novus ordo missae of paul 6th aka pauline/venacular mass & 40 years of incredable abuse of the catholic Mass, I believe it is time to COME HOME.fIRST AND FOREMOST THE sspx is not in schism with the Vatican & AS MORE THAN ONE CURIA MEMBER HAS SAID THE SSPX IS IN AN IRREGULAR situation with the vatican not Schismatic & it would do well for the multitude of novus ordo bishops, priests & laity to understand and accept that.The SSPX need to regularize with Rome as soon as possible as their 500 priests (and growing everyday)are badly needed in the mainstream of the church. To that end the Supreme Pontiff needs to recind the "excommunication" of the 4 presiding Bishops and especially the Saintly founder of SSPX. It needs TO happen now so this awesome organization of Orthodox priests & Bishops can help implement and aid the advancement of the new papal Motu Proprio on the Tridentine Liturgy. Just mayby God has had enough of the BS that has gone on in the Church for 40 yrs and the heresies in the Mass will end end. Are you listening Tod Brown, Roger Mahoney & Ricard???? Shalom


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